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Author Topic: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build  (Read 25315 times)

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Offline pubquiz

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Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« on: December 28, 2010, 17:12:51 PM »
Hi All

Thought I would post this just in case it's of any help to anyone building this model.

I liked the look of the new Jamara traditional build kits and as I am not really into ARTF (having built from plans and kits for the last 40 years) and saw the Gee Bee Z on ebay brand new for the bargain price inc p&p of 50 so got it.

Good bits are: The quality of the laser cutting is spot on with 90% of the parts literally falling out from the sheets and the rest only needing minimal assistance with the scalpel. The general quality of the wood is good ..all be it a bit soft for some components.

The price is pretty fair as well.

Bad bits are : The instructions are terrible! the pics are quite poor showing little detail, the shape of some formers are different than that shown on the pics.

Also the numbers on the pics are wrong for some parts leading to alot of head scratching! Also at least one part so far as been wrongly numbered on the part itself....see pic later...

There is no plan and the 'plan' on the included cd is not a plan it is just a line drawing...no parts are numbered on it.

The CD contains no extra info or pics or drawings than those included in the instruction book, and any instructions are VERY basic.

If Jamara are trying to get folk back into traditional building it is a poor effort instruction/plan wise.

Anyway I only started it yesterday and the build is well underway ...all parts fit great ...once you have worked out where they go!

I am not going to make this a complete build thread but I will keep adding the odd pic of parts that badly described/numbered etc if anyone is interested.

Be prepared for a long thread though as I have sudden surges then long gaps while I am occupied with other stuff like building a 1/4 bud Nosen Aeronca Champ...Astro photography...flying full size gliders..messing with my kit car...etc etc and the dreaded word...work:(

Anyway will now post some pics that may be of some use.

Tom


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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #1 on: December 28, 2010, 17:23:09 PM »
This is a pic of 2 of the 'front fuselage rings'   the 'A' ring on the left and the 'B' ring on the right.

the A ring is the first to be fitted then the 'B' which is VERY slightly smaller in diameter.

You will see that each is made of 4 parts..the top is RF3 each side is RF2 and the bottom is RF1

On the drawing in the book it says the top is RF2 each side is RF1 and the bottom RF3!!...clearly wrong!

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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #2 on: December 28, 2010, 17:29:23 PM »
Here is a pic of the 'C' and 'D' rings....these are made up of just 3 pieces each ...as before RF2 are the side pieces but this time RF1 is the top piece....there is no bottom piece on these 2 rings ...these a alot smaller diameter than the others so creating the required 'forward chamfer'


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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #3 on: December 28, 2010, 17:36:11 PM »
Here the rings are glued in place ..A ring as the rearmost coming forward to the D ring...the difference in diameter can be seen...as mentioned..the A and B rings are ALMOST the same diameter...the others visibly smaller.

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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #4 on: December 28, 2010, 17:43:39 PM »
Here is a pic of an examble of a wrongly marked part...this is one of the 'rings' that make up the cowl....I am not ready to fit this yet but thought I would glue together the rings...you can see the part marked CV2b should have been marked CV2a ...the real CV2b (part of the cowls 'b' ring) is slightly different in size....check yours carefully for fit before glueing together!


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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #5 on: December 28, 2010, 17:49:11 PM »
I don't know where these parts go!...they look like fuselage formers but don't appear to go anywhere ..they are not shown on the miserable drawings...maybe they are part of the wing to fuselage fairing ...will probably become apparant when building the wing! One part isn't eben numbered...maybe the number was adjacent to it on the dicarded sheet it came from?

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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #6 on: December 28, 2010, 17:57:55 PM »
Here are a couple of pics of the progress so far....as mentioned it so far seems an easy build once the mistakes have been spotted ..it seems to be going together OK

Thats it for now...will add anything relevant at a later stage

Tom

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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #7 on: December 28, 2010, 19:34:15 PM »
Looking good, you've got to give Jamara some credit for releasing a kit version.

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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #8 on: December 29, 2010, 01:42:44 AM »
Hi FrankS

Yes I agree ..today seems all ARTF and to see a company come up with a range of traditional balsa build kits is fantastic...also the models they have picked coincidentaly correspond to some of my favourite aircrfaft...and the tech in producing the kits is superb...ie the laser cutting.

BUT and it's  BIG but ...these are small electric kits so...aimed at beginners wanting to get into building a model in the 'old' way from a kit.

SO shouldn't the instructions be ABSOLUTELY accurate in every stage?

Every photo should be accurate......all proof reading of the instructions should be done by someone who has built it..

A proper plan should be provided...yes even on a CD would be ok...as long as it showed all former/stringer etc positions ....what is the point in including a CD in the kit that just gives EXACTALLY the same (useless) instructions
as the printed instruction book.?

It also gives the useless build instructions for the rest of this current jamarra range ...which is of no interest to me!!

So yes credit to Jamara for bringing out some traditional balsa kits BUT sort out the plans...build instructions and photos for gods sake....as if they don't get their act together this will be the last of their kits i will buy.

As an example to any Jamara employees...look at the instructions in... Great Planes..Marutaka...and Topflight (Royal) kits...just to name 3

20 year old plus kits....but with great build instructions

There is ABSOLUTELY NO EXCUSE today to bring a kit out with useless/faulty/wrong instructions as the Jamara Gee Bee Z kit is

I am also building at the mo a 1/4 scale Bud Nosen kit...this is 30 years old and the instructions are pretty basic and of not much use BUT the plans are EXCELLANT ...EVERY former stringer bulkhead etc is shown....

OK with great instructions and photos ...a plan isn't always required BUT if you  don't supply a plan with your kit (and note Jamara...it isn't a plan you give ...just a basic line drawing) YOU HAVE TO give  a PROPER photo build with pics that actually have the correct numbers for each part!!

I think Jamara is a German company ...if this is correct it amazes me as most stuff from Germany is spot on.

The quality of the instructions in this kit is more like something from (pick a 3rd world country of your choice!)

Tom

« Last Edit: December 29, 2010, 02:09:49 AM by pubquiz »


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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #9 on: December 29, 2010, 08:00:13 AM »
I built up a Graupner GeeBee Sportster last year, it was supposed to be ARTF, but was more like a BRTF, ( barely ready to fly.) The build instructions were for an earlier model to the one I had. If you followed the instructions to the letter then some things would have had to be removed again to get it right. Many upgrades had been done to the model with out the instructions being updated. I reckon though, that lots of details are missed out in the translations, and more often than not, they assume you know more than you actually may do. $%&
Global RC Sukhoi, GeeBee Sportster, GM Magician, WTF 109 Wardog, Flying Illusions 285 Spifire, Piper Cub.

Offline tim hooper

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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #10 on: December 29, 2010, 08:34:25 AM »
...... saw the Gee Bee Z on ebay brand new for the bargain price inc p&p of 50 so got it.


I wonder if the instructions were updated in more recent kits? 

I did read the RCM+E review, which agreed with you that the kit & instructions were sadly lacking in many respects, although the author was very happy with the eventual outcome and performance in the air.

tim
I never finish anyth

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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #11 on: December 30, 2010, 16:17:14 PM »
XM954 Yes would have expected more from a big name like Graupner...nice looking model though...I take it it's the one as your Avatar?

Tim...I ahvn't been able to find a later set of instructions.

the kit comes with a CD with all the instructions and line drawings for the whole range on it ie the Bonananza,Mew Gull, Beaver, and Pitts as well.

Every one of them are far better instructions than the Gee Bee!....The same pic of the Mew Gulls undercarriage though appears in most of them!.


Anyway just done a bit more to it so here come some more picsl:

Tom

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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #12 on: December 30, 2010, 16:31:01 PM »
Made the top (removable) hatch today ...again wrongly numbered parts on the instruction book drawings :)

The wide end of the hatch is the front ..you will see from the pic that the front former is D4, the middle is D2 and the back one D3.

In the book it says the front is D2 the middle D3 and the back D4...so totally wrong!

The shape of the formers in the pics are also totally different having trinangular cut out holes instead of circular and the middle one having a flat bottom instead of it's actual 'arched' shape.

Have attached pics of it before and after sheeting

Tom

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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #13 on: December 30, 2010, 16:46:23 PM »
Also started to build the cowl.

The 'A' parts are not brilliant quality wood ..it is very heavily grained and the laser cutting need quite alot of assistance with the scalpel..a few of them ..especially the tiny triangular 'key' pieces broke off and had the glued back on.

In the instruction book it says 'Glue the horizontal spacer plates into position'

However these are not in the kit and have to be made from scrap wood.

I also used 5mm square stock for the 4 joining stringers instead of the suggested 4.5 x 3mm stringers (the same as used for the fuselage stringers) as the 4.5 x 3 in the kit is very soft.

There is no measurements given to haow long these should be so i had to print out the cowl pic (from the .pdf on the CD) at 100% and measure it.....to save you having to do this it is 85mm...cut 4 pieces at 85mm each and join the 2 'A' rings together.

Once this is done I pinned the assembly to the fuselage in position then measured the size of the 3 'horizontal spacer plates'and glued them in place to the front and rear rings.

These are a snug fit to the central 'box' shape of the front fuselage

the cowl is glued in place once the model is covered and finished ...I suppose strong magnets could be used if you want it to be removeable.

That's all for today...pic attached

Tom

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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #14 on: January 10, 2011, 18:43:48 PM »
Just completed the cowl

More wrongly numbered pieces in instructions

You will see in the pic the final of the 4 'rings' glued to the front of the cowl ...this is the 'D' ring and is the most forward (ie at the front of aircraft) the rings are lettered 'A' to 'D'

It is made up of 4 parts 2x 'CV1D' and 2x 'CV2D' ...I have labelled them in the pics

However in the instruction book diagram these are labelled 'CV3' and 'CV4' with no letter mentioned!

I used extra cross members where the butt joint of each piece of 1.5mm ended to give extra support for the butt joint

Offline steamysheep

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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #15 on: January 10, 2011, 18:45:22 PM »
oooo, missed this one, now subscibed...  :af
Keeping my chin up!

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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #16 on: January 10, 2011, 18:49:34 PM »
Hi Stueysheep

Like I say don't count on a quick build from me though  ;) ...I have bursts and long lulls :)

Anyway here is the cowl after sanding...the wood is very soft so sands very quickly

Tom


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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #17 on: January 11, 2011, 15:35:40 PM »
Built the rudder

More wrongly labeled components (no surprise there  >:( )

In the book components SL1 SL2 and SL3 are correct.....the 3 cross mebers are wrong though... the top one in the book is called SL4 when it is actually S1..the middle one is called SL5 in the book and it is actually S2 and the bottom one in the book is SL6 and it is actually S3....see the pic

The 3 parts S 1,2 and 3 can be found on balsa sheet 7 in the kit

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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #18 on: January 11, 2011, 15:41:05 PM »
The vertical member (SL1) could do with being wider though.....I found when offered up to the fin that it was alot narrower due to the fuselage being sheeted with 1.5mm sheet.

I therefore stuck 2 strips of 1.5mm sheet each side of it therefore matching the width of the fin surface it will be hinged to.

See pic

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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #19 on: January 11, 2011, 15:48:38 PM »
Built the tailplane and elevator.

Surprise surprise the component numbers seem to match those on the diagram!

The diagram is very small though so easier just to look at the pic below....I like the way the cross members are cut to lay into the leading and trailing edges ...no need for triangular fillets.

The fitting of a couple of the laser cut cross members was not quiet as snug a fit as the fuselage components but still pretty good.

The picture in the book showing the attachment of the elevator joining wire is a pic of a completey different tailplane elevator!...presumably the Mew Gull one.

See pic

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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #20 on: January 11, 2011, 21:37:46 PM »
Hi pubquiz,

Just to let you know that I recently finished my Jamara Gee-Bee Z though it hasn't flown yet. Totally agree about the standard of the plan/instructions but it does eventually build in to a nice model.

You're obviously progressing well but if you do hit a brick wall don't hesitate to ask and i'll gladly help out, it's definately a head scratcher at times!!

All the best,

Greg.

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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #21 on: January 11, 2011, 21:39:32 PM »
The vertical member (SL1) could do with being wider though.....I found when offered up to the fin that it was alot narrower due to the fuselage being sheeted with 1.5mm sheet.

I therefore stuck 2 strips of 1.5mm sheet each side of it therefore matching the width of the fin surface it will be hinged to.

See pic

Just noticed this, yep, did exactly the same on mine!!

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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #22 on: January 11, 2011, 22:00:45 PM »
I don't know where these parts go!...they look like fuselage formers but don't appear to go anywhere ..they are not shown on the miserable drawings...maybe they are part of the wing to fuselage fairing ...will probably become apparant when building the wing! One part isn't eben numbered...maybe the number was adjacent to it on the dicarded sheet it came from?

You're quite right it will become apparent when building the wing but I might as well put you out of your misery!! They form the underbelly which is built onto the wing and comes off with the wing when it is removed.

Greg

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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #23 on: January 11, 2011, 23:43:19 PM »
Hi Greg

A BIG THANKS for that :)....yes I am dreading starting on the wing as the instructions for it are none existant as you will know.

i will very probably be asking your advice on it :)

Tom

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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #24 on: January 12, 2011, 16:16:00 PM »
Have started building the wings today.

Am SLOWLY working out which bit goes where.

This kit has obviously undergone a design change as the one i have got has parts totally different from the one in the instruction book!...don't know whether mine is an early or late one

I have been looking at pics on a German build thread ...unfortunately all the posts are in German and there is no translate facility on the site.

There are pics in the thread (it's a long one) of both versions of the kit ...but there is still loads I will have to work out myself :banghead:

The wingtips and undercarriage supports in particular are a totally different design between the 2 versions

Will post some pics when I have got some of the wing done :xx

Tom

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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #25 on: January 13, 2011, 14:13:20 PM »
Got some glue drying so having a break to post these pics.

Here are parts FW1 and FW2 these ply doublers go either side of Rib R4 and form a slot that the undercarriage wire goes in....When cutting out rib R4 from the sheet save the bits that come out of the gaps to use as a former to bend the wire round...I threw them away and only realised my mistake after reading the German thread...not too vital but may be a help when I come to bend the wire

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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #26 on: January 13, 2011, 14:21:20 PM »
Here is the right hand wingtip the cross member/stiffening ribs are part numbers R10 R11 and R13 which are glued to the wingtip piece R12 and then glued to the wing rib R9

This is as mentioned a totally different design than the one shown in the book and the 'plan'

The ribs run in order of R1 at the root to R9 at the tip.

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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #27 on: January 13, 2011, 14:28:18 PM »
This is of the Aileron...I decided to build it as part of the wing pinned to the 'plan' (BTW you will have to print the plan from the .pdf on the CD in A4 sheets selotaped together unless you have access to a large format printer)

I then cut it out after glue had dried. You can see the gap between QR2 and the wing trailing edge ready to take part no QR4 which is the aileron leading edge

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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #28 on: January 13, 2011, 14:35:43 PM »
Here are the slots cut in the ribs ready for part QR4 ...I cut these, then dry fitted QR4 then cut the ribs from the rear spar ready to glue QR4 in place and also the QR1 aileron end rib also a pic of the aileron detached and glued together.

Again this design is totally different to the instructions/plan which show an aileron built on balsa sheet with circular lightening holes!
« Last Edit: January 13, 2011, 17:22:49 PM by pubquiz »

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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #29 on: January 13, 2011, 14:42:42 PM »
This is the leading edge Part number NL2 (soft balsa) is glued to the ribs then part NL1 which is a harder grade is glued to the front of NL2....at least I think this is what you do...I assume it is to make the leading edge less prone to 'dings' when comlplete.

Make sure you get NL2 central vertically on each rib to allow space for the balsa sheeting of the forward section of the wing to butt join up to it
« Last Edit: January 13, 2011, 17:27:48 PM by pubquiz »

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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #30 on: January 13, 2011, 14:54:36 PM »
Here are the slots in ribs R2 and R3

They are a double thickness slot to allow for the fitting of the dihedral brace when joining the wing panels.

When glueing the ribs to the main ply spar (H1) make sure H1 is butted up to the REAR of the slot in R2 & R3 as the ply dihedral brace is fitted to the FRONT of H1

I didn't make sure of this when initially glueing the wing and had to enlarge the slots

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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #31 on: January 13, 2011, 15:09:16 PM »
The ply parts S1 are glued to the bottom of the wing between ribs R5 & R6 these act as a support for ply part S3 which is the surround for the ply part S2 which is the aileron servo hatch cover which will be attached with tiny screws at each corner ...screwed into the S1 parts..after covering and radio installation.

That's it for today...the glue will be dry now so I'l do a bit more then off for a few pints  ;D

Tom
« Last Edit: January 13, 2011, 15:11:14 PM by pubquiz »

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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #32 on: January 16, 2011, 23:05:10 PM »
Been doing the undercariage today

So far this is the trickiest bit of the build...thought the wing construction would be difficult dued to no instructions but it prooved reasonably straightforward

However working out a way to do the undercart has NOT BEEN easy

Detailed report will follow soon.

Tom

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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #33 on: January 18, 2011, 17:06:31 PM »
Done much more of the undercart but not taken the pics yet so will just post these 2 pics then give a more detailed update.

I decided to put some side extension pieces either side of the undrcarriage mount rib just to increase the area to glue the top of the wheel spats to.

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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #34 on: January 18, 2011, 17:11:04 PM »
This is the framework of the bottom fuselage to wing fairing before covering with sheet balsa

The aforementioned pieces at the begining of this thread are used here.

Went and bought the motor, speed controller, servos, LiPo, receiver pack, and prop today as well.:)

Tom

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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #35 on: January 18, 2011, 17:30:57 PM »
Hi Tom,

You're making good progress. They must have changed the design since I bought mine because the bearer plates that sandwich the U/C wires are fitted along the front and rear spars on mine!!  I also fitted some extra sheeting to give the spats something to bang against though!!

Looks really good so far, any ideas on your colour scheme yet?

All the best,

Greg

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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #36 on: January 18, 2011, 18:49:54 PM »
Hi Greg

Yes there has definately been a design change....I bet the wingtips and ailerons are a different design on yours as well, along with a few other minor bits.

Looking back I think I would have replaced the stock stringers with some slightly harder balsa ones...they are very soft....I have lost track how many I have snapped while holding it for sanding etc  ::)

Re the colour scheme....I was going to do it the red and white scheme but now find myself liking the yellow and black scheme more. :-\What colour did you do yours?...post some pics on this thread if you like.

Any advice on cutting out the letters etc?...pity there isn't a ready made sticker sheet as there are quite a few tricky shaped trims to cut

Tom

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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #37 on: January 18, 2011, 20:45:28 PM »
Yep quite right my ailerons were sheet balsa with lightening holes in them. Don't know why they changed that as it worked very well!

I also plumped for yellow and black from the startling array of two schemes to choose from ;D s'pose I could have come up with something original but I did want it to look a little like a gee bee!!

Here's how she looks...


I didn't bother adding too much detail as it was only really intended as a hack model but overall I'm pleased with the way it turned out. Bit of a dodgy dummy radial up front but I didn't want to spend ages building one but had to do something to fill that giant hole in the cowl!!

Still you can see that after all the Jamara aimed cursing it does eventually build into a reasonable model ;D

Best of luck with yours, hope the rest of the build goes smoothly :af

Greg.



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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #38 on: January 18, 2011, 23:39:29 PM »
Hi Gregg

That looks fantastic.....yes yellow black just narrowly gets it over red white.

Re the dummy radial...yes must do something to fill the hole...looking at the German thread have seen folk use a photo printout and some have sourced a plastic extrusion assembly.

What did you use as it looks quite good.

Also what's it like to fly?

Tom

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Re: Jamara Gee Bee Z pics of build
« Reply #39 on: January 19, 2011, 14:21:10 PM »
I have done lots of head scratching re the undercarriage.

Idealy I would have liked the spats just to surround the piano wire leg allowing some sprung movement of the leg to give the usual shock absorbing capabilty.

I once built a scale Stuka with similar wheel pants made the same way from laminations of balsa. This was a much bigger .60 powered model though so the pants were much bigger so allowing space to do this.

So I bent a 90 degree bend on the end of the wire to act as the wheel shaft (just like the normal way on a small fixed undercart.

However when the wheel was on the whole assembly was just too wide to be surrounded by the wheel pants.

So  I have just built it as per the instructions.....the wheels are mounted with a bolt through the spat.

This gives no 'suspension' movement at all so I am hoping it is up to the job....the model is small and light so hopefully it will be ok...time will tell....at least it will make me try harder to get greaser landings ;)

First pic is of the piano wire supports epoxied into the slots in the wing rib


 

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