Topic: Ashdown Sussex Open Cross country comp

I dont know if cross country has died off nationally, but I know down here  in Sussex, It is no longer a propper event
I was made aware some time back that there used to be a big XC comp on Ashdown Forest
and Paul W has reminded me with this great pic

I would like to get this event running again, but I need to know there is enough interest

I was thinking big national contest, run by me if necessary, I'm sure ESSA will let me use club equipment if they did not want to get involved

just need to know if people would be interested in a big XC down in Sussex next summer

I know it may seem early to think about it, but this gives me ages to get around any hurdle's

What sort of gliders would be eligable for this comp?

Would soarers from the HL / 200w/kg be eligable as long as the motors were only used for launch?

I dont think there are many who have tow men available these days.

What sort of gliders would be eligible for this comp?

Would soarers from the HL / 200w/kg be eligible as long as the motors were only used for launch?

I dont think there are many who have tow men available these days.

If there is enough interst and I can get past all the red tape that is put in my way, I will get all the old rule books out, talk to the BMFA, talk to my club and sort everything out.

What sort of gliders would be eligable for this comp?

Would soarers from the HL / 200w/kg be eligable as long as the motors were only used for launch?

I dont think there are many who have tow men available these days.

I thought it was usually a slope side launch.


EDIT: thinking about it f3h is winch launch.  I think they fly X-country off the Tors in Dartmoor from time to time. 

I thought it was usually a slope side launch.

Please, lets not start debating the rules and the arrangements or this thread will pull away from weather there is interest in what seems to be a forgoten part of RC gliding
it would seem it needs to start with an F these days or it is not a comp 

F3F F3J F3B F F F F

maybe if I call it F country I would get more interest 

I agree Allen.  I think you just want to organise it for whatever suits the local conditions.

It would be a good laugh if you had enough people to do it. I think a slope launch would make life easier. 

There are so many variants at the mo
I dont even know if we would be allowed to do it on Ashdown anymore?
Personal sole flight and holding an event are so differant
I have pinged a few emails out to people that would have been involved in the past events and will know a little more about what I am up against

at my club meeting a few months back I read through a risk assessment we had to write when trying to get permission to fly at a flat field site

yes that's right a RISK ASSESMENT

and if anybopdy under the age of 18 is going to compete   youve got no chance

People still do the occasional cross country flight from Ivinghoe Beacon.

My understanding was these tend to be slope side launches too (though I do remember reading an article about someone controlling a model whilst standing up in a car, up through the sun roof).

I quite understand the wish to keep things flexible for the minute, but some details will have huge significance - for instance are you talking landing furthest from the start, or max distance travelled round say a triangular course?
(this defines/excludes venues, and whether people attend may of course be effected by whether they need to travel 50 or 250 miles each way!).

Personally, I've a feeling that Hadrian's Wall would make a classic cross country venue (assuming "the north wind doth blow") but what do fliers local to it think?  Something like the "Handiran's Wall Classic Open Challenge" has a nice ring to it :-) (though flying a glider, end to end, on a single flight, might prove a bit of a challenge!!)

Anyway, I'd certainly be interested, would prob use an Algebra 100S (as it stays up well in light lift, shifts well when you drop the nose a little, and is low tech and cost me very little!). 

Having tried to organise slope events before, I wish you luck trying to book the wind!

Nige

Allen, from what I read in Eric's post there might have been tow guys involved, hence why I asked if electric were permissable.  It would also make it more accessable to others who might wish to take part but may not have someone willing to run ahead with a tow line.  I would certainly be interested if electric gliders were admisable.

I'll retreat to the sidelines and watch so see what happens.

Host it in Cornwall/Devon and I'm there 

My blaster 2 DLG will take a winch launch right? 

I get the feeling the comp will be restricted by what ever I need to do to make it happen unless it makes it Carp

If slope launch is not suitable of feasible then a winch/ bungee is possible

I think adding power will probably add more red tape but I have not ruled anything our yet

Chas Gardiner wrote this on slope XC:

From up here

We are talking 6 month away, more than enough time to find a cheep large wingspan floater on fleebay   

I have an old 1986 soaron sunshine open 139" on VERY slow rebuild in the shed.

(this is not an I'm out to win model, this is an I'm out for a great day model)

News so far

Allen
Ashdown forest is a BMFA site so any comp there needs there go ahead, and the club that use’s it. Which I think is mainly free flight? But as an open BMFA site as the Longman you can fly there as a BMFA member.

I do believe that the trophy for this comp has just been handed back to the area committee.

Any way yes could be a good idea, any help I can . Not to sure of access now, been years since I flown there. But a good site.

Venue needs to be right and so do the conditions - which does make the event very diffficult to organise - almost to the point of having several dates with the view of picking the one that has the right conditions to make it a challenge.

This Is why I chose Ashdown forest because there was once a big xc comp held there that was very popular, so the venue is good and with a bit of luck I can use there ideas to make it right

Chas Gardiner wrote this on slope XC:

From up here

I love this extract from Chas's webpages :

The ’Lotus Eaters’ are alive and well and thriving on our hills, with a euphoria akin to the surfer who has found the ’perfect wave’. The subject can be dominating to the exclusion of wife, kids, house and job but after the ’honeymoon period’ emerges as a psychologically well balanced, healthy, rational, methodical, caring individual, with an inward satisfaction which a Zen Buddhist would recognise and admire (who am I kidding?). Slope soarers are without doubt, devout in their worship. They will undertake a lengthy round trip or diversion to inspect possible sites. Holidays are never taken except within reach of hilly country, and if forced elsewhere, will spend hours watching the gulls and mentally twiddling the sticks. If you are still with me and are even vaguely curious, read on. In the series of articles, which follow, it is intended to present the hows and whys, the do’s and don’ts which will take you from a clueless novice to a proficient aerobatic pilot. Maybe I have more confidence in your ability than you have, but it won’t cost you a fortune to find out that I was in fact right all along. I am not proposing to teach you how a glider flies; you don’t need to know if you do what we tell you. All you really need is the basic knowledge that if the air is going up faster than the model is coming down, you have extended flight. Right?

SO TRUE ! 

Outside of this forum I have had massive interest

the trophy is being recalled from the achive museum 

All systems are go

It would be a power winch launch off the cusp of a bowl

I am having a meeting in the new year to get the ball rolling 

"Ashdown Forest"?  Hope it's not a true forest anymore....

"Ashdown Forest"?  Hope it's not a true forest anymore....

I think the pic on the first post might help

Although I bet it could be easy to lose your model

Although I bet it could be easy to lose your model

The comp had a reputation as a 'model eater'. I'd be suprised if people would want to risk thier mouldies there Allen.

Try and be focused about the sort of event you want to hold, and where you want to hold it.

I want A propper XC comp and this seems like the right thing to do
I will buy one of those cheep screamers that goes in a servo socket on the RX
But I plan to fly a Built up wing floater, for the nostalgic beauty not a XXXL mouldie for efficiency and the trophy

I'm thinking wife, kids picknick, Floaty glider on beautiful summers day, loads of differant planes from all sizes and styles and loads of chat
that's the comp i want
but it would seem that there are about 5 clubs that are interested in this comp being brought back to life, so I will probably be push in the direction of the way it used to be done

I'm thinking wife, kids picknick, Floaty glider on beautiful summers day, loads of differant planes from all sizes and styles and loads of chat
that's the comp i want

Maybe you need to pitch it more as a non-mouldie, nostalgia type event then?
IIRC Ashdown was a circular route rather than an absolute distance.

Now I know the comp is a go, I would love to here what others would like to see, I could use a R&E floater and have the day I want no matter how it pans out but it is more important to get bums in seats as they say
it was lack of interest that killed it before,
not everyone goes to a comp to win I would just be happy to be apart of a big summer gliding event
If there was enough interest you could have classes 

I here in the original rules you were allowed one re launch with hand tow and it was a really hard comp

Very interested here, count me in!

I will try and join in if possible Allen. It's the sort of thing I've been wanting to give a try for a while now.

Allen,

Below is the path of the old XC course - It is very much a thermal event, although there can be very light slope lift in certain places, dependent on the wind direction on the day.  It is 3.2Km/2 miles around the course, over difficult terrain in places.  A bit easier at the lowest point of the course where you cross the stream, as there is now a bridge.  In the past you had to scramble down a steep bank, through the stream, and then up a steep bank.

Simon

Well I have had messages from loads of people and if this interest carries on it might have to be a weekend event

next year I will make a new thread with dates and rules etc

can let this one die now if you like 

Allen, from what I read in Eric's post there might have been tow guys involved, hence why I asked if electric were permissable.  It would also make it more accessable to others who might wish to take part but may not have someone willing to run ahead with a tow line.  I would certainly be interested if electric gliders were admisable.

I'll retreat to the sidelines and watch so see what happens.

Ooops, I seem to have started a ball rolling.

Well done Allen for taking on the challenge of reinstating the event.

When I last flew the course, each entrant had a team of three people to go around the 2 mile course, the pilot, his helper/timekeeper and the tow-man or tow-woman (anyone remember the East Kent Soaring Association member, Liz Hopkins?). I can't remember being limited to a single relaunch, but obviously you didn't want to land at all during the circuit, 'cos having to tow a model up down in the valley on a hot day is a real b****r. Ideally it should be a launch at the start and then find a thermal or three and maybe some gentle slope lift on the way round, (if we were lucky and a sou' wester was blowing - take a look at the contour lines on the map) and land on the spot back at the start point - QED.

It's a tough course but a great challenge. You get to fly round once. but end up walking it two or three times as you need to be available to be part of other competitor's 'teams' and help them around the course.

This event is not about winning, it's more about taking part and the challenge of beating the terrain and the elements. I think as well as awarding the main trophy, an award could be made for say the most memorable flight of the day as, be assured, there will be some 'interesting' situations arising.

Thanks again Allen.

This style of event is less interesting to me than a cross country slope event where you need to read the slopes as well as the thermals, and jump between slopes etc.

What you describe is a flat field thermal comp with an obstacle course to walk around while you fly.

I would not attend this style of event.

Having flown in this event, I can confirm it's definitely not just a flat field thermal thermal comp with an obstacle course.

A few miles away from Ashdown Forest are the South Downs where I have also flown slope style cross country events of the type you describe, where you have to swap between different slopes, read the terrain in between, fly out of slope effect and also pick up thermal lift to complete the course. I do also enjoy that type of event as well having come second the last time I flew in such a competition, being beaten to the winning post by a narrow margin by Chris Foss.

To fly at Ashdown Forest is an interesting mix between the two, but until you visit the area, you cannot appreciate the uniqueness of the Forest and challenge of its terrain. It is a place that has played host to aeromodelling competitions for many years.

The cross country event declined in popularity and so ceased to be held in recent years and I think that Allen is to be congratulated for his efforts in raising interest in the event and getting it back onto the competition calender.

This aerial shows the bowl quite well

The cross country event declined in popularity and so ceased to be held in recent years and I think that Allen is to be congratulated for his efforts in raising interest in the event and getting it back onto the competition calender.

It would be interesting to know why it declined in popularity then, and see if there are ways to address that in the new format..

It would be interesting to know why it declined in popularity then, and see if there are ways to address that in the new format..

That is my plan.
In an Idea world I would like to satisfy the people that loved this even and find ways to open it to new
It is often the case that had people realized the lack of numbers where jeopardising the event they would have made the effort

but you do have a good point if it was GREAT then it would not have died

but I will do my best to make it what everyone wants it to be

But to do that I need to know what you would like to see

Although It is odd how much interest I have had
If everyone that said they would love to see the ashdown open back actually came we could run the event twice.
but maybe that's the problem, everyone would love to come but no one turns up 

Maybe an entry fee and a good price is the way to go  

Pete at South coast sailplanes said he might be able to help with a price
like a 2.5 Topaz

Have now got Chris Foss on the job of helping me with rules, and ways of opening it up to electric as well as built up and fully moulded models, as he flown it many times, and also would love to do it again

Sounds like you have a plan Allen. To get the most entrants and add some variety (the spice of life!) I think finding a way for electric power models to compete (with height limiter/logger installed perhaps?) and even hand launch (F3K) models would be great. The Sussex Open Winter League is a mixed model event that is being tried out with great success.

I'd be seriously tempted to come along if electric and/or DLGs were allowed

Tony

Hi all

I have very fond memories of Ashdown Forest XC from when Peter Allen (is that Allen the soarer I wonder?) and his wife Jean used to run the comp.

100" span RES models were good enough then.

Would I fly it again?

Yep!

I will wear wellies next time though   

Jef

Hi all

I have very fond memories of Ashdown Forest XC from when Peter Allen (is that Allen the soarer I wonder?) and his wife Jean used to run the comp.

100" span RES models were good enough then.

Would I fly it again?

Yep!

I will wear wellies next time though   

Jef

No not me

But I hope to keep it much the same, but add some classes
I will have a power winch for non powered glider as the starting launch if possible and hand tow there after
but also hope to allow electric launch gliders too with a height restriction on launches

or at least something like that 

...very fond memories of Ashdown Forest XC from when Peter Allen ... and his wife Jean used to run the comp.

My memory is marvelous.  

Two days after posting this I remembered it was Pete and Jean Clark that ran the Ashdown Forest XC...