Topic: Ben Buckle/Sid King 'Novice'

hi all,

i hope there might be some on here that lend there experience. at my club there has been an 'explosion' of interest in the Ben Buckle kitted, Sid King designed Novice.

http://www.stevewebb.co.uk/index.php?pid=BBNOV&area=Aircraft

this all started (i think) with me asking a very good friend what the model was that he was flying. anyhow long story short there is now (i think) 15 or 16 Novice models in the club, and all the flying/flown ones have diesels for power including mine.

there is one chap though how has said that he is putting a glow into his, and that now there going to be a seperate class (in the fun comps) for glow powered versions. what i would like to know is has anyone had recent experience of a glow powered Novice?? what engines have been used?? were they throttled?? how well they balance?? i seem to remember that the original was powered with an OS 10fp.

so what can you tell me??

cheers

nick

Taken from the link you gave:
The Novice is very simple, it is hand launched and is suitable for the beginner. It can perform mild aerobatics on its diminutive .10 sized engine and for those who don't want an engine at all, it can be used for slope soaring.

Span 50" (1270 mm)

Engine Size .10 2 Stroke

Radio 2 or 3 Channel
 What else ?

reallly i wanted to know if anyone has experience of flying one on glow. all of the models i have seen are diesel powered, even my one

Excellent little model, I learnt to fly on one 30 years ago, mine was powered by an ME Snipe 1.5cc Diesel and guided by Digimac III radio, my LMS at the time, Wallingford Model Center used to sell loads of these kits and also ready to fly with PAW 149 and Acoms 2ch radio .  Soon I will be building one with my daughter, not sure if I  go deisel or small glow yet.

i recon they are great little aircraft. my first one was built for my daughter to learn on....but she was only 2.5yrs at the time 

since then it seems that everytime i take it out someone else says 'oh i'm building/built one of them'

now i'm going to build another for a sc .12 so just wondered how it will compare to the diesel powered one i have.

the diesel one goes up like a homesick angel on a 'well used' PAW 1.45. it takes a starter to get it going but once its going it goes like the clappers. the diesel engine guru in the club has dianosed it as catagory F requireing a re-bore. in the mean time i have changed it for a AM 15. should be a bit more sedate.

cheers

nick

PS if anyone else has a Novice and would like to take part in a Mass Novice Flight, why not bring it along to Machrihanish in May?? we are aiming for 15+ model in the air at once if we can get all the little diesels going at once 

just found these from last yrs Machrihanish event

Well I've just ordered mine from BB via Ebay, I've gone for an OS10LA to power it, my daughter can't wait to get started, of course it will be covered in pink.

well today after flying my orange one above, i came home and spoke to my daughter about the next one i'm building. apparently it is going to be blue and white wings so that daisy can paint them 'alsorts' of colours!!.

today i also fired up the little SC .12 and for a little engine its got a lot of go!

I can't wait to get started on the Novice, I learnt to fly on one and had lots of fun with it and it would be nice if the next generation ie my daughter got the same pleasure from this classic model.

Hi,

 a bit of an old thread, I know.

Just bought one of these kits after having the plans for a couple of years and never getting around to it.

It's been a long and I mean long time since I have built up a kit using balsa cement, tissue paper, dope etc..
I see things have moved on a little such as solarfilm, cyano etc..

I may be calling on you (pestering more like!) for info and tips, hope y'all won't mind.

Regards..,

MT

not a problem for me 

not a problem for me 

Cheers nickr100 I really appreciate it. 

Hi,

 a bit of an old thread, I know.

Just bought one of these kits after having the plans for a couple of years and never getting around to it.

It's been a long and I mean long time since I have built up a kit using balsa cement, tissue paper, dope etc..
I see things have moved on a little such as solarfilm, cyano etc..

I may be calling on you (pestering more like!) for info and tips, hope y'all won't mind.

Regards..,

MT

I doubt you'll need much help, they are easy to build, this is my daughters which we built together.

I doubt you'll need much help, they are easy to build, this is my daughters which we built together.

andy, what engine is in that? looks good!

OS10LA which is more than enough power, I've now installed a vintage Enya 09 but haven't flown it yet.

Nice seeing new posting to this thread, We certainly had fun with the diesel powered ones. I had threatened to use a .12 glow until I got real stick from Bryan Passey, and ended up fitting a PAW diesel. Oily little sods, but, brilliant. Still fancy doing one for the .12 glow though. Recession and weather seamed to have it's effect on the numbers who turned up at Machrihanish 2011.

We still want more "Novice" pilots to turn up and really fill the sky with them.

Okie dokie, got an SC12 motor on the way, just trying to get a few more things organised and could do with some input.

Adhesives, now I am used to regular balsa cement but see that now the norm is cyano.

I have read that some cyano is difficult to sand.

What adhesive do you use and where do you purchase it from?

Regards..,

MT

For "trad" wood kits I mainly use aliphatic glue - LHS should stock it. PVA wood glue is an alternative.  For high stress areas (usually around the firewall)  I use 30 min or 1 hour epoxy, (never 5 min) usually heated with a hair-dryer once in-situ as it helps it flow and gives a better cure.  For fuselage doublers I use evo-stick or similar contact adhesive.  Don't really like cyano but it has its uses.

For "trad" wood kits I mainly use aliphatic glue - LHS should stock it. PVA wood glue is an alternative.  For high stress areas (usually around the firewall)  I use 30 min or 1 hour epoxy, (never 5 min) usually heated with a hair-dryer once in-situ as it helps it flow and gives a better cure.  For fuselage doublers I use evo-stick or similar contact adhesive.  Don't really like cyano but it has its uses.

i would agree with the above. my personal preferance for this type of build is aliphatic, its quite quick to dry and sands easily. i do use CA but mainly for 'tacking'

Yep no cyano used on ours, just PVA and epoxy.

Thanks guys, got some Aliphatic and 1 hour epoxy winging it's way to me. My SC12 motor turned up yesterday, still waiting for the kit to arrive, hopefully should be with me today.

Don't forget to fuel-proof the airframe before you cover it. 

as of yesterday, i now have Novice kit no.4 and no.2 sc.12 on order. looks like i shall be building two of them similtaniously with the two apprentices.

as of yesterday, i now have Novice kit no.4 and no.2 sc.12 on order. looks like i shall be building two of them similtaniously with the two apprentices.

As a matter of interest, where did you get your SC12 from?

The best deal I found for mine was http://www.phoenixmp.com cost was £29.95

Well, I'll be making a start on my Novice tonight, wish me luck.

Having said that, the kit looks very thorough with comprehensive instructions which is ideal for a lapsed modeller like me.

I'll try to remember to take a few piccies of my progress.

Are any of you Novice owners out there from the South West, Devon in particular?

Regards..,

MT

i got my sc.12's from my local model shop Paisley Model Centre. they might not be the cheapest on unit price but once postage is added on they are cheaper as such, and i do get a bit of a loyalty discount cos they know i like to 'shop around' for the best price 

unfortunately im not in devon......im near paisley 

i got my sc.12's from my local model shop Paisley Model Centre. they might not be the cheapest on unit price but once postage is added on they are cheaper as such, and i do get a bit of a loyalty discount cos they know i like to 'shop around' for the best price 

unfortunately im not in devon......im near paisley 

A half decent model shop for me is about 1.5hours drive away unfortunately.

All the model shops I remember as a kiddie have long since closed.

A half decent model shop for me is about 1.5hours drive away unfortunately.

All the model shops I remember as a kiddie have long since closed.

certainly if PMC wasn't there or on my doorstep i would do a lot more internet shopping, both from the UK and abroad.

Well my foray back into modelling went quite well, (pics to follow).

The only issue that I can see may cause me a problem is that the wing ribs in the kit are slightly longer than the plan and while everything else is set out correctly on the plan, the ribs themselves overhang the TE lower W4 member by about 2mm.

I have thought about trimming them off flush with the outer edge of the TE and then filling any obvious gaps when I eventually get around to fitting the TE Top W5 piece, after shaping of course.

This may be a compromise but I think a much simpler solution than reshaping the trailing edges of all the ribs.

All I have actually done so far is up to step 11 of the 'Building The Wings' section.

I'm quite time limited with working nights and been shattered on my day off each week, so progress might be drawn out a little.

Regards..,

MT

Some piccies.


Novice-001 by MadTogger, on Flickr


Novice-002 by MadTogger, on Flickr


Novice-003 by MadTogger, on Flickr

I have had the same issue on the 3 kits I've done. All I did was move the leading edge forwards keeping the spar in the drawn location. This also means the wing section matches the fuz side on the plan

I have had the same issue on the 3 kits I've done. All I did was move the leading edge forwards keeping the spar in the drawn location. This also means the wing section matches the fuz side on the plan

Yeah, I'll know next time to check and dry fit the ribs prior to anything else.
Unfortunately, I had already glued the leading edge in place and it was set solid, so no moving available.

Looking more closely at mine now, I think I will just fit the top TE in place as is and use a tiny amount of filler on the underside because if I try messing around with the ribs insitu I think I'll get myself into a right pickle.

The overall cross-section of the wing will remain unchanged, exactly as the plan shows, so, fingers crossed.

Also, I still have the LH wing to do and I will have to do it exactly as I have done the RH.

Regards..,

MT

Woohoo, I am so happy with progress so far.

I started the LH wing panel yesterday morning and managed to get to the point of joining both panels *gives myself a pat on the back*

Although I had the start work at 2am this morning I was still up until 11pm last night, (no sleep yawn yawn), fiddling around trying to get both panels to join snugly.

After lots of measuring, use of spirit level and plumb line, I got it and am soooo happy.

I must say it was a bit of a headache trying to fix the wings in a straight line with no forward or backward sweep to them.

I'll post some more pics soon.

Regards..,

MT

Going back to an earlier post about the ribs overhanging the TE W4 piece, well I have just spent a couple of hours figuring out how to overcome this to be able to fit the TE W5 piece.

What I actually found is that the ribs are 7mm too long, so I firstly carefully trimmed them back and gently sanded one to the correct shape ending in the point at the TE, of course, stopping to check every now and again to make sure I didn't over sand.

Then when I was happy with that rib I made a template from it using stiff card and used this template as a check against all the other ribs while I sanded them.

I finally got to a stage to fit the TE W5 top piece in place on one wing panel and it looks pretty good.

Just got to wait for the glue to dry now to start on the other side.

Perhaps I should have checked the ribs against the plan before assembling the wing but honestly I purely forgot, that'll teach me but hopefully I have diverted disaster.

Regards..,

MT

Here are a few more pics of my progress so far.

Having to stop now as it's back to work tonight, roll on Monday for my next day off.

View from RH wing panel.

Novice-004 by MadTogger, on Flickr

View from LH wing panel.

Novice-005 by MadTogger, on Flickr

LH & RH wing panels joined with TE top W5 piece in place.

Novice-006 by MadTogger, on Flickr

Regards..,

MT

Well I've got the LE sheeting on now and during the process I was wondering to myself the best way to shape the leading edge and get a uniform finish.

I found a very useful tip and that is to make a negative profile in a block of balsa and glue in some sandpaper to this negative, then use the block to sand.

I just need to wait for the lump of balsa to turn up from Balsamart now.

Regards..,

MT

Well I've got the LE sheeting on now and during the process I was wondering to myself the best way to shape the leading edge and get a uniform finish.

I found a very useful tip and that is to make a negative profile in a block of balsa and glue in some sandpaper to this negative, then use the block to sand.

I just need to wait for the lump of balsa to turn up from Balsamart now.

Regards..,

MT

i just use a david plane, and then a permagrit block to finish, and do it by eye til it 'looks about right'

do you know yet if your tip blocks are to short in height? all of mine so far have been and ive had to add on a bit of sheeting prior to sanding and shaping

i just use a david plane, and then a permagrit block to finish, and do it by eye til it 'looks about right'

do you know yet if your tip blocks are to short in height? all of mine so far have been and ive had to add on a bit of sheeting prior to sanding and shaping

Thanks for the pointer about the tip blocks, they are indeed short in the height department, approx half the thickness of the sheeting I would say.
I'll some spare sheeting on them in preparation.

As for the LE shaping, your eye would seem far better than mine, I would probably end up with rather nice looking scalloped edges. 

I will be leaving the wings alone for a bit now while a wait for a few bits and bobs to arrive and be making a start on the FUS.

I would like to say that so far all has gone swimmingly with this model but the accuracy of some of the parts is questionable, having said that though, for someone like me who is getting back into the hobby after a long absence, it is making me think more and interact more with it while building, anyone can snap together a beautifully laser cut kit. 

Regards..,

MT

MadTogger

Just in case there is no reference to it in the instructions, it could be a good idea to pin the wing back on the board before you sheet the leading edge. This can help considerably to prevent a warp creeping in when you least expect it. And now is a fairly critical stage, because once you've added the leading edge sheeting you'll find you'll have "locked" the wing into it's final shape and form, particularly now the spar webs have been glued in. Warps can then be an absolute sod to get rid of.

MadTogger

Just in case there is no reference to it in the instructions, it could be a good idea to pin the wing back on the board before you sheet the leading edge. This can help considerably to prevent a warp creeping in when you least expect it. And now is a fairly critical stage, because once you've added the leading edge sheeting you'll find you'll have "locked" the wing into it's final shape and form, particularly now the spar webs have been glued in. Warps can then be an absolute sod to get rid of.

Thanks for the tip Brian.

Although like you said, this is not stated in the instructions, I did anyway to make life easier for myself.

Regards..,

MT