Topic: Fut Telemetry finally.

A friend told me on the phone an hour or so ago Fut had posted details of their upcoming 18MZ set on their site. Of little interest to me, but I'm sure some will drool........  And if you'd like a picture of yourself drooling, there is a built in digital camera. Oh dear......

It seems Fut are finally about to make the leap to telemetry for their users who'd like it.......

Here..... 
http://www.futaba-rc.com/systems/18mz.html

A friend told me on the phone an hour or so ago Fut had posted details of their upcoming 18MZ set on their site. Of little interest to me, but I'm sure some will drool........  And if you'd like a picture of yourself drooling, there is a built in digital camera. Oh dear......

It seems Fut are finally about to make the leap to telemetry for their users who'd like it.......

Here..... 
http://www.futaba-rc.com/systems/18mz.html

ooo I want one! God knows what the price will be........

The wrong side of £1000 I'd imagine Bob.......   

Maybe even £1500+?

Still, some experts at marketing say if you place something just out of reach, it makes some potential purchasers want it even more.....

Personally I think Fut's time would have been better spent updating their low/mid range sets, but at least they're improving the styling somewhat. The ghastly false chrome has now gone, to be replaced with an infinately more tasteful satin look. Why, even the pointless false hex boltheads have been banished. Have Fut been reading my posts?

The wrong side of £1000 I'd imagine Bob.......   

Maybe even £1500+?

Still, some experts at marketing say if you place something just out of reach, it makes some potential purchasers want it even more.....

Personally I think Fut's time would have been better spent updating their low/mid range sets, but at least they're improving the styling somewhat. The ghastly false chrome has now gone, to be replaced with an infinately more tasteful satin look. Why, even the pointless false hex boltheads have been banished. Have Fut been reading my posts?

beyond my meagre finances, but I hope they will use the styling on the cheaper sets!

Unless they drop he price of the 14MZ significantly I suspect this will be noticably over £1500.

The ghastly false chrome has now gone, to be replaced with an infinately more tasteful satin look. Why, even the pointless false hex boltheads have been banished. Have Fut been reading my posts?

No, they've just jumped several stages and gone straight to the 1990's...

It's definitely better looking then the old range, but looking at the likely prices maybe they didn't need to gold-plate inside the battery bay?

Guess I'm not in the target market then 

Nor I imagine are most folk Yoyo.

This set will sell well in the US, as Fut products do by the container load. It's very definately one for the better heeled among modellers, and perhaps those with Championship aspirations. That said, Fut will sponsor a sprinkling of potential winners, as always, and they'll get one for nowt.........

I just looked again. The styling is very crisp/clean for a Far Eastern radio. If they'd carry this styling down the range to their lesser sets, they'd take an even bigger slice of the market.

More likely another first for Futaba, a radio over the £2000 mark......

More likely another first for Futaba, a radio over the £2000 mark......

Youre depressing me- I was just seeing if I could raise £1,500...........

More likely another first for Futaba, a radio over the £2000 mark......

I fear you might be right but when you think of the type of laptop you can get for £1200 it does make our TX's look like a major rip off 

I fear you might be right but when you think of the type of laptop you can get for £1200 it does make our TX's look like a major rip off 

I suppose its the old adage of if you want it bad enough, you will pay for it.How they can even justify £1500 for a 14mz eludes me, especially seeing you can get an 8fg  tx for less that £250.
A quick down load from Futaba,'s website gets that up to 14 channels , 12 of which proportional.So a colour touch screen as per my cheapy £60 mobile phone, and a couple of extra mixers add £750 to the price?  Your having a laugh......

So t latest and greatest from the thoughtful designers....... Where have they put the display for the telemetrists ? right under your hands, result!

Do any of the developers actually use any of this stuff, at least one company got this right.

J

I'm still waiting on the Telemetry upgrade for my poor old 8FG 

Well I almost mentioned the screen being in the wrong place John, but just for a change I thought I'd dodge the flak and leave that for someone else........

The user will of course have a whole raft of audible warning he is able to program, but just occasionally users will want a quick visual........

Well I almost mentioned the screen being in the wrong place John, but just for a change I thought I'd dodge the flak and leave that for someone else........

The user will of course have a whole raft of audible warning he is able to program, but just occasionally users will want a quick visual........

I suppose that means we will have to LOOK at our transmitters- dont think I have ever done that.....

I often look at mine Bob, but only when I'm cleaning, programming or charging it..........

The user will of course have a whole raft of audible warning he is able to program, but just occasionally users will want a quick visual........

Good point, why waste the cash on colour screen if you're not going to look at it?

I think the whole telemetry aspect has very limited applications, the audio side is good, especially for gliders / variometer use but a lot of the other 'uses' IMHO are gimmiks.

J

Unless I'm reading it wrong it only supports 8 channels unless you are using S-Bus.

Even if i could afford it I'd still stick with my 14 channel 8FG, thanks.

Gimmicks possibly John, but it's a start. It's where we'll be in, say, 5 years that may be interesting.

I totally agree re: the screen. it's in the wrong place and seems too large to be practical. That's marketing though....... I'd wager Futaba's mindset is pretty much if it looks good, it'll sell good.

P.S. The built in camera is very definately a pointless gimmick. But what next? A folding shovel clipped onto the back of the transmitter, all ready to dig the model out after a crash perhaps.......

Personally I think Fut's time would have been better spent updating their low/mid range sets

They are.....................

Well they certainly need to BR. If the FF7 had been a horse, it would have been shot about 3 years ago.

With the possible expection of the gliderists..

I honestly couldnt care less about telemetry - another new set of clothes for the chap at the top.

Like the look of the new set though - way out of my price range, Will stick with my 7C until I can afford an 8FG.

Chris

Telemetry - it's one of those things you never thought you needed - bit like 2.4 - rechargable batteries - iron on films - etc etc!

Yep telemetry is useful - very at times 

Yep telemetry is useful - very at times 

Well I can see the point for a glider vario but beyond that ??

J

Well I can see the point for a glider vario but beyond that ??

Battery low (especially for fault conditions where a cell dies rapidly, or lightweight stuff with teeny batteries), signal problems like interference or just long range, battery/motor temp in high performance power models, fuel gauge in thirsty jets, all sorts.

Obviously its not absolutely vital or we wouldn't have been able to fly wihout it all these years, but it has it's uses.

Well I can see the point for a glider vario but beyond that ??

Altitude for a 7+kg model ?

Steve

The single most useful feature is onboard battery monitoring - wouldn't be without it now - it's a model (and even life) saver, potentially.

I'm a died in the wool Multiplex fan - where Multiplex lead, others usually follow (FM - PCM - etc etc etc)

Careful Enginetorque, you'll start a riot. I hear blood stocks are low just now........

P.S. John. I know you were never an advocate of telemetry, but it's an evolutionary thing. Soon all but the most basic systems will include telemetry of some sort. Ok, most flyers don't and won't need it, but at least it is there to add an element of safety. What's perhaps of more interest is data logging. This will undoubtedly be of interest to those who compete, or who need to make meaningful comparisons between models or various servo, control or power set-ups etc.

Altitude for a 7+kg model ?

Steve

Not calibrated and therefore should not be relied upon, no staitic vent etc etc.

J

The single most useful feature is onboard battery monitoring - wouldn't be without it now - it's a model (and even life) saver, potentially.

I'm a died in the wool Multiplex fan - where Multiplex lead, others usually follow (FM - PCM - etc etc etc)

Could quality batteries, battery check before flight, never had a problem. A single cell starting to die will not sound an alarm before it's too late telemetry or not.

J

Careful Enginetorque, you'll start a riot. I hear blood stocks are low just now........

P.S. John. I know you were never an advocate of telemetry, but it's an evolutionary thing. Soon all but the most basic systems will include telemetry of some sort. Ok, most flyers don't and won't need it, but at least it is there to add an element of safety. What's perhaps of more interest is data logging. This will undoubtedly be of interest to those who compete, or who need to make meaningful comparisons between models or various servo, control or power set-ups etc.

Agreed but IMHO, it's no deal breaker or latest must have unless you're a glider guider and then the vario information would be very relevant. The data logging aspect may also be useful in a new / development model but in terms of real time stuff I really don't see it as needed.

Then again, I suppose it could always be used to show an aircraft doesn't climb and slow down when turning into wind or descend and speed up when it turns downwind 

J

Not calibrated and therefore should not be relied upon, no staitic vent etc etc.

Certainly can be...

http://www.rc-log.co.uk/altimeter-microsensor-v3.html

But I accept that the general market versions won't be super calibrated and have all the various compensations etc. that a full on scientific altimeter would have, but then again, they won't cost £1000 each either...

If you just want a 400' AGL height limiter, I suspect the CAA would be very happy with these as opposed to nothing, especially if you set your alarm at say 380'.
 

Certainly can be...

http://www.rc-log.co.uk/altimeter-microsensor-v3.html

But I accept that the general market versions won't be super calibrated and have all the various compensations etc. that a full on scientific altimeter would have, but then again, they won't cost £1000 each either...

If you just want a 400' AGL height limiter, I suspect the CAA would be very happy with these as opposed to nothing, especially if you set your alarm at say 380'.

This is exactly the danger. You have the telemetry, based on pressure in the cockpit and not a pitot tube, no static vent = no idea what the real height is. IF the cockpit becomes pressurised the altimeter will read low so you then have a sortie to find out what 400' looks like and end up at 600' or whatever. An instrument that is not accurate is WORSE than no instrument at all because it misleads you.

J

John

I think the new M-Link GPS unit (measures airspeed, altitude, distance from Tx) is fitted with a form of pitot head. I'd expect it to be quite accurate too, as the M-Link vario certainly seems to be.

Would need to be installed with the pitot outside the prop arc though, obviously.

I think the new M-Link GPS unit (measures airspeed, altitude, distance from Tx) is fitted with a form of pitot head.

I would be surprised if the M-Link GPS measures pressure, but I suppose that it might do. If memory serves, GPS isn't very good for altitude (it's great for time though).

Steve

This is exactly the danger. You have the telemetry, based on pressure in the cockpit and not a pitot tube, no static vent = no idea what the real height is.

If you look at the link you'll see it is designed with a stub for a pitot tube to the outside world to deal with exactly that issue.

John

I think the new M-Link GPS unit (measures airspeed, altitude, distance from Tx) is fitted with a form of pitot head. I'd expect it to be quite accurate too, as the M-Link vario certainly seems to be.

Would need to be installed with the pitot outside the prop arc though, obviously.

Vario is easy, it's a relative measurement i.e. are we going up or down and how fast, altitude is a very different game.

J

An instrument that is not accurate is WORSE than no instrument at all because it misleads you.

In my experience, this isn't the case. It is however, nice to have a feel for the accuracy and repeatability of a measurement. In the case of an altitude sensor on a toy aeroplane, I think that I'd be more than happy with +/-10%.

Steve

Just out of interest how do you know it's +/- 10% ?

I looked at a telemetry equipped Angel S50, just holding it on the ground and running the motor gave - 180' about as much use as a chocolate teapot yet some people rely on it to stay below 400'. I know you can't estimate by eye but this stuff is no better.IMHO. If it floats your boat to know you're at 257', pulling 35 amps and the motor temp is 35 deg C then thats cool, it's not for me.

J

... I think that I'd be more than happy with +/-10%.

But 10% of what?

An altimeter is measuring changes in air pressure and relating that to height.  In round numbers, the air pressure at sea level is about 1000mb and drops by 1mb for every 30 feet or so increase in altitude.  So a height rise of 400 feet corresponds to a decrease of around 13mb.  That's a change of only 1.3% that the sensor has to accurately measure.  Add to this the pressurizing/depressurizing effect of air flowing into/out of the space that the sensor is sitting in and all sorts of inaccuracies are possible.