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New EU 2.4 ghz regulations

Started by tomkfly, January 06, 2015, 09:24:44 am

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Cactus

ah good, i'm two way with the DIP switches for the older V series mini rx's

firmware update somehow then?
I know you believe you understand what you think i said, but i am not sure you realise that what you think you heard is not what i meant.

satinet

Quote from: bobt on January 12, 2015, 14:08:53 pm
That is not actually the case. I have a set of in-ear monitors which cost in excess of £700 ten years ago. From two years ago it became illegal to use them as the frequency was needed for 4G. I still use them, but could be prosecuted. So no grandfather's rights there.


I did say usually to be fair!

satinet

Quote from: Cactus on January 12, 2015, 14:15:47 pm
ah good, i'm two way with the DIP switches for the older V series mini rx's

firmware update somehow then?


I don't think you need to do anything Phil. But as the chart refers to the XJT/Taranis you can't be sure. That being said, logically your "d mode" (two way) should be the same "d mode" in the xjt/taranis, and the pre-update xjt/taranis module works with both pre and post update RXs, if that makes sense! The way I read it is you should be able to run new X series receivers in d mode.  But obviously worth checking with Frsky/whoever to confirm.

PDR

Quote from: Loopdreams on January 12, 2015, 13:49:45 pm
Yeah, I remember there were a whole raft of reasons why 2.4Ghz was a bad idea, how the whole band would become unusable in a couple of years, how it would never catch on with serious aeromodellers and how 35Mhz and peg boards were just better. LOL.


There's still time. Remember that Vince Cable's status as an ecomoinic guru was based on the way he predicted none of the last two recessions...

:ev

PDR
There are no shortcuts on the long, hard road to success. But if your dad's rich there could a limo service...

Patmac

Quote from: Cactus on January 12, 2015, 13:05:54 pm
to work with the new receivers that won't listen to my stone age modules.


Have you seen this table ?
AFAICS it means that every RX that works in D8 mode will work with a Tx using either version of firmware.
However an X series Rxs that are not upgraded will only work in D8 mode with a new firmware Txs.
When they are upgraded they will be compatible with D8 & D16.
Pax vobiscum

grayuk

January 13, 2015, 08:26:11 am #45 Last Edit: January 13, 2015, 08:27:45 am by grayuk
Having briefly scanned through the regs, I can not see anything that particularly indicates any specific radio that is effected.
The only one I would consider may be impacted is the early non hopping Spektrum gear, this was always a sticking point with the EU regulators.
FASST is just a patented variant of FHSS, with preamble Ariel selection, which helps eliminate packet loss, so as far as the regs are concerned it should be considered as FHSS.
I shall be talking to Futaba today to get the full SP, but remember, these regs are not new, anyone in the industry has pre warning of up coming changes. If there was an impact, then Futaba, JR etc. would have know and prepared. Also, the BMFA would have been informed and there has been nothing from them, my feeling is that this is just a 'loose end' tie up, mainly directed at Chinese imports that are non compliant.

Paul G

tomkfly

Quote from: grayuk on January 13, 2015, 08:26:11 am
Having briefly scanned through the regs, I can not see anything that particularly indicates any specific radio that is effected.
The only one I would consider may be impacted is the early non hopping Spektrum gear, this was always a sticking point with the EU regulators.
FASST is just a patented variant of FHSS, with preamble Ariel selection, which helps eliminate packet loss, so as far as the regs are concerned it should be considered as FHSS.
I shall be talking to Futaba today to get the full SP, but remember, these regs are not new, anyone in the industry has pre warning of up coming changes. If there was an impact, then Futaba, JR etc. would have know and prepared. Also, the BMFA would have been informed and there has been nothing from them, my feeling is that this is just a 'loose end' tie up, mainly directed at Chinese imports that are non compliant.

Paul G

My understanding is FASST Transmitters don't comply and can't be upgraded. The latest  FASSTest Ones are okay.

Tom
When you change the way you look at things, the things you look at often change.        www.deesidemac.co.uk
Gravity, thou art a heartless bitch

itsme

I shall wait until the EvenFaaster ones come out.

grayuk

I have just got off the phone with Futaba/Ripmax.
1) The changes have been in the pipeline for a long time and FASSTest is compatible, as may well be some of the later FHSS and FASST systems purchased over the last year.
2) This reg applies to all NEW sets imported into the EU after Jan 1st, you can still buy any set that was imported prior to that date and it is completely legal to use.
3) New FASST and FHSS systems are compliant with the new regs.
4) The changes are slight to the transmission only.
5) All existing systems are perfectly legal to use and all existing FUTABA receivers will continue to work with the new transmission changes.

Effectively this is invisible to us as FUTABA users, zero impact.
I can not comment on JR or other systems, but I am sure that all of the major players will have been preparing for this change.
The only concern maybe the 'compatible' non brand rx's, we will have to wait and see.

Paul G

dickw

Current FASST transmitters, the 14SG and the 18MZ, can be updated to the new regs and the latest Futaba firmware update for the 14SG (v5.0) will do that. New ones will of course come ready updated.
Some FASST comaptible Rx do not work well with the updated FASST transmitters and FrSky have already issued an update for their FASST compatible Rx that solves that problem.

Dick
Grow old disgracefully

onewinglow

The main changes to the regs EN300 1.8.1, If transmitting at over 10mW (RC is 100mW approx) requires LBT (Listen Before Transmit) and MU (Medium Utilisation) of no more than 10%. Futaba FASST (original) does not LBT and has a MU of 25%. AFAIK Modules and older Tx are not updateable due to hardware constraints. The effects on other protocols; Spektrum, newly made/imported Tx will no longer be backward compatible with DSM2 as they will not be allowed to transmit DSM2 as it is non complient. So, if you have 'Bind and Fly' and/or DSM2 Rx look after your existing Tx!. FrSky, updates are available for some Rx (own and compatibles) and some Tx modules, but the last time I checked nothing for the D series. Oh, don't forget this is just for the EU and not the rest of the world so there is always the possibility, in the future, of buying from abroad. Although, you risk the items being confiscated by the customs if they inspect the package.

tomkfly

January 13, 2015, 12:31:07 pm #51 Last Edit: January 13, 2015, 12:38:17 pm by tomkfly
Quote from: onewinglow on January 13, 2015, 11:56:59 am
The main changes to the regs EN300 1.8.1, If transmitting at over 10mW (RC is 100mW approx) requires LBT (Listen Before Transmit) and MU (Medium Utilisation) of no more than 10%. Futaba FASST (original) does not LBT and has a MU of 25%. AFAIK Modules and older Tx are not updateable due to hardware constraints. The effects on other protocols; Spektrum, newly made/imported Tx will no longer be backward compatible with DSM2 as they will not be allowed to transmit DSM2 as it is non complient. So, if you have 'Bind and Fly' and/or DSM2 Rx look after your existing Tx!. FrSky, updates are available for some Rx (own and compatibles) and some Tx modules, but the last time I checked nothing for the D series. Oh, don't forget this is just for the EU and not the rest of the world so there is always the possibility, in the future, of buying from abroad. Although, you risk the items being confiscated by the customs if they inspect the package.

The Fr'Sky V and D series, apparently. are compatable with both versions of TX Firmware.

Tom
When you change the way you look at things, the things you look at often change.        www.deesidemac.co.uk
Gravity, thou art a heartless bitch

fly-navy

Oh Lordy this is all too technical for me :embarassed:
I have the 2 way FrSky DFT modules in my FF9 tx's and have mostly V8FR-11 8 rx's in my models, am I legal or is it another cash splash out or shall I get my PCM rx's out of storage and put original modules back in  :xx
Now that I am older I thought it was nice I seemed to have more patience,turns out  I don't give  a sh*t

grayuk

Please remember, anything you have can continue to be used, it only applies to new equipment imported into the EU after Jan 1st.

Paul

itsme


tomkfly

Quote from: bobt on January 13, 2015, 13:09:45 pm
Any of this apply to Hitech?

I believe Hitec already meets the new regs.

Tom
When you change the way you look at things, the things you look at often change.        www.deesidemac.co.uk
Gravity, thou art a heartless bitch

satinet

Quote from: fly-navy on January 13, 2015, 13:00:09 pm
Oh Lordy this is all too technical for me :embarassed:
I have the 2 way FrSky DFT modules in my FF9 tx's and have mostly V8FR-11 8 rx's in my models, am I legal or is it another cash splash out or shall I get my PCM rx's out of storage and put original modules back in  :xx


You are legal

fly-navy

Thank you, thank  you ,thank you :-* :-* :-*
I can keep some of my chrizzy presents then.
Now that I am older I thought it was nice I seemed to have more patience,turns out  I don't give  a sh*t

itsme

Ah. Thank goodness for that. Its a rats nest of legislation.

Bigtradioman

 I have just got off the phone with Futaba/Ripmax today

1) The changes have been in the pipeline for a long time and FASSTest is compatible, as may well be some of the later FHSS and FASST systems purchased over the last year.

2) This reg applies to all NEW sets imported into the EU after Jan 1st, you can still by any set that was imported prior to that date and it is completely legal to use.

3) New FASST and FHSS systems are compliant with the new regs.

4) The changes are slight to the transmission only. There is only 1 power setting on all new Tx,s, just a Europe setting.

5) All existing systems are perfectly legal to use and all existing Futaba receiver will continue to work with the new transmission changes.

Effectively this is invisible to us as Futaba users, zero impact.

However, compatible rx's are an unknown, they probably will work, but we will have to see.

I suggest a phone call to Horizon for the Spektrum and for Sanwa and Hitec from the impoter.

Thorough range checks before flight if you buy new compatible rx,s from Orange etc.
There is a firmware update for Futaba 14sg and 18 mx.  The last update for the 8fg, the one that turned it into 14 channels did the same.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Windy

That's oddly similar to GrayUK's post earlier.

PDR

I think these new regs are a massive improvement - in fact can anyone tell me how to get the "listen before talk" firmare version loaded into SWMBO and my daughters?

PDR
There are no shortcuts on the long, hard road to success. But if your dad's rich there could a limo service...

grayuk

January 14, 2015, 12:52:29 pm #62 Last Edit: January 14, 2015, 12:54:16 pm by grayuk
Yep. it is my post  ::)
Bigtradioman has cut and pasted it from another forum I would guess  :''

'Stranger things happen at sea'  $%&


Paul G

itsme

Pete- how do they get a word in edgeways?

Mike_T

You can ask that without blushing?

itsme