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May 29, 2020, 11:06:01 am

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Dual Aileron Mixing - Ultra Stick 10

Started by Acey, May 02, 2020, 21:21:45 pm

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Acey

Hi All,

Can anyone shed some light on this subject / how its possible.

I currently have the flaps set up via a switch on my Spektrum DX9. The ailerons are set up standard in separate ports on the receiver:

* Aileron - Right Aileron > Aux 2 Right Flap
* Aux 1  - Left Aileron > Gear Left flap

I am trying to set a mix where I can hit a switch i.e Switch B and it will make the flaps and Ailerons work all together for i.e 3D.

Anyone managed to do this?

I have the aircraft in ACRO setting on the DX9, should I be using sailplane?

I've so far only managed to mix it so one side all works, however due to the servo reverse for the flaps to work together, I don't seem to be able to set this up.

I've managed to get it working, however without flaps as 1 goes up in this case and 1 goes down due to the servo reverse.

Any suggestions welcomed (great model by the way  :)  :) )Plane.jpg

 


PDR

I think this is is something the control architecture of the Dx9 just doesn't support. If you want to do this you need a radio with one of the more sophisticated architectures - it's a piece of cake in any of the OpenTx transmitters (Taranis, Horus, QX7 etc) and I've done a similar thing* with a Multiplex Evo.

PDR

* I had inboard flaps and outboard ailerons. Small amounts of up or down flap moved the ailerons and flaps together (in one flight mode this was coupled to elevator), and large amounts of flap either only drove the inboard flaps or turned on the crow braking (depended on flight mode). Aileron control either just drove the ailerons or (in a different flight mode) started driving the inboard flaps as well, but only beyond half aileron travel. On the multiplex evo this was just one mixer and two software switches, but in opentx it's easier.
There are no shortcuts on the long, hard road to success. But if your dad's rich there could a limo service...

dickw

I don't know anything about Spektrum so this may or may not help, but there is a thread on another forum that discusses a 4 servo wing on the DX9.
https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?2628880-Dx9-flap-menu-and-channel-assignment

I have done similar setups on Multiplex and Jeti where it is fairly simple to do.

Dick
Grow old disgracefully

PDR

The issue with the mainstream radios is that they don't separate the "servo" layer from the "controls" layer, so when you do mixing it's never clear whether you're mixing a control input or a channel output. Multiplex changed all that decades ago with the Profi 3000/3100/4000 sets where they took a leaf from full size flight control system design and came up with a more rational architecture. This was simplified for their more mainstream Royal Evo transmitters, but still had the same basic architecture of

stick/switch/slider -> control -> Mixer (optional) -> servo output (rx channel)

This basic architecture is still there today, and was only developed further when the OpenTx group developed the Taranis (et seq) software. Similar concepts were adopted by other more sophisticated transmitters like the Jeti and (I think) Weatronic ones, but the "mainstream" manufacturers (Futaba, JR, Horizon, Sanwa etc) have stuck to the path of only really supporting their pre-defined model types so they are very easy to set up, but very difficult to do anything unusual.

Horses for courses.

PDR
There are no shortcuts on the long, hard road to success. But if your dad's rich there could a limo service...

Acey

Thanks all for your helpful replies. Not the end of the world that I can't configure this, was just an idea for 3D.

If want in the future I can always set it up as a full span aileron without flaps.


Brian Cooper

It should be perfectly possible to do. . It just depends on how many free mixers are available to play with.  $%&

I have this exact (flap/aileron) switchable set-up on my DX-18.
Make the ailerons the "master" channels and just get the flaps to follow them.

Have fun. 

FlyinBrian

May 04, 2020, 09:05:32 am #6 Last Edit: May 04, 2020, 09:06:33 am by FlyinBrian
Quote from: PDR on May 03, 2020, 15:37:59 pmThe issue with the mainstream radios is that they don't separate the "servo" layer from the "controls" layer, so when you do mixing it's never clear whether you're mixing a control input or a channel output. Multiplex changed all that decades ago with the Profi 3000/3100/4000 sets where they took a leaf from full size flight control system design and came up with a more rational architecture. This was simplified for their more mainstream Royal Evo transmitters, but still had the same basic architecture of

stick/switch/slider -> control -> Mixer (optional) -> servo output (rx channel)

This basic architecture is still there today, and was only developed further when the OpenTx group developed the Taranis (et seq) software. Similar concepts were adopted by other more sophisticated transmitters like the Jeti and (I think) Weatronic ones, but the "mainstream" manufacturers (Futaba, JR, Horizon, Sanwa etc) have stuck to the path of only really supporting their pre-defined model types so they are very easy to set up, but very difficult to do anything unusual.

Horses for courses.

PDR

I sometimes wish I had never got rid of my 3030 (Apart from the Pizza box quips) but MPX were just too slow getting into 2.4 Gig. Of course almost as soon as I bought my JR DSX9 MPX brought out a 2.4 module for the 3030 / 4000 DOH!
Basic Research is what I do - when I don't know what I'm doing!.

dickw

Quote from: FlyinBrian on May 04, 2020, 09:05:32 amI sometimes wish I had never got rid of my 3030 (Apart from the Pizza box quips) but MPX were just too slow getting into 2.4 Gig. Of course almost as soon as I bought my JR DSX9 MPX brought out a 2.4 module for the 3030 / 4000 DOH!

I know what you mean, I even converted my 4000 to the german ACT S3D system ( https://www.acteurope.de/html/2_4ghz_conversion_system.html ) while waiting for Multiplex, and flew with that for several years.
In the end I went to Jeti, as ACT were also looking like a dead end project.

It is also a great pity Multiplex never developed the 4000. I recall several forums from back then with titles like "Beyond 4000" and "The 5000 Project" looking at updating and developing the software and even finding a manufacturer willing to make hardware for it. Easy to see where Open Tx and FrSky came from!

Dick
Grow old disgracefully

FlyinBrian

Easy to see where Open Tx and FrSky came from!

Oh yes :af
Basic Research is what I do - when I don't know what I'm doing!.